Okay so I made this argument before. Pop singers like Selena Gomez, Miley Cyrus, Justin Bieber, Rebecca Black whoever are being marketed for a younger audience for the most part. I happen to be 18 years old so why should I give two shits about them? Why should I go out of my way to say that they are terrible? It's obvious that I'm not a part of this market. It just makes people look stupid and immature. I wouldn't look at a bunch of fuckin barbie dolls and talk about how shitty they are...

I have said it time and again. I don't like Justin Bieber, I don't hate him either. I nothing him.

I argued this a long time ago so that was just to get people up to speed. It got me thinking. One of the main arguments I got was that it's normal for older generation to look at current music and look badly upon it, like how older men in the 1960's didn't care for The Beatles. But, is that really what's happening here, because as far as I can tell, most old men today don't know who the hell Justin Bieber is. It's people in their late teens and early 20s that are reflecting all of the hate.

Still with me, because this still isn't the main point I was trying to make.

yeah sure, it might be normal for older generations to look down upon current music and trends however, aren't we in the unique situation where we can change that? If it's not 40-50 year old men, but people in their late teens and early twenties, an age where you aren't old enough to say that you don't know any better, then we have the ability to defy this ongoing pattern that has been happening for a couple decades of music now. I mean, wouldn't it be nice if future generations could enjoy their music without older generations looking down upon it or trying to prevent it from being shown on different platforms of media? People don't need to like it, they just need to ignore it.

It's obvious that these artists are harmless, and sure as hell don't deserve receiving FUCKING DEATH THREATS for making music for middle school brats. Why not adopt a new attitude? An attitude that involves, not giving a single fuck about these artists. Man I hate people...

I don't see it as a trend worth breaking. If my parents rocked out to Nirvana or Pearl Jam or Metallica, would I have still liked them? Doubt it. Part of that generational disparity is what motivates younger listeners to gravitate toward certain genres of music.

Nostalgia plays such an important part of my playlists that there's no room for anything new. I don't keep up with modern music so, like an old man, I find today's musical trends confusing. I don't remember the last time I bought a newly released CD or purchased a Top 40 mp3. I'll be 29 next month and I'm not hip. But I do like Adele.

...wow, that really sounded like an old man talking...

Don't get me wrong. Every now and then I'll find something newish I like, like Daft Punk, but I'm always late to the game and don't regularly seek it out.

Now, how Justin Bieber plays into this I don't know. The hate comes from his popularity, not his music. I think the only generational disparity is that kids don't mind being inundated and adults reach their limit much faster....probably talking out of my ass but I think that plays a role somewhere.

Well, I dunno if it's a generational thing nowadays. When the Beatles were getting going, the older generation went from this being the dominant sound growing up:



to this being the dominant sound as their kids grew up:



It's understandable that they would have an aversion to the new dominant music scene that was driving the culture. Now most of us went from this being the dominant sound growing up:


to this being the dominant sound now:



I don't think it's wrong to think that popular music is somewhat empty today. I mean, I don't hate it to the point that it makes me angry, but I dislike it. Is that me being old? Perhaps, but I think it's more having experience and developing taste to recognize when something is manufactured crap. There are plenty of bands I used to like as a middle schooler that I recognize as absolute crap now. A kid in middle school who has never heard music that has feeling or true talent or emotion wont know that Black Eyed Peas suck. I mean, a kid like Justin Bieber has talent, but that's not special. There are a ton of people who can sing and sing well, I know many. His talent isn't so much singing as it is his image and his looks. He doesn't really give a sound that is well crafted or unique.

It's true that it's not music made for us... but it's not really made for anybody past the age of 13 anyway. I see many people growing out of these popular bands that are around today. Many people I grew up with actually reach back to what our parents listened to. I think it says something that artists like the Beatles, The Rolling Stones, Marvin Gaye, Janis Joplin survive to today and still have a strong following while huge music artists today are punchlines.

I don't think that the influence for the artists of tomorrow are going to come from the Biebers... it's going to come from these much smaller bands that have die hard fanbases. Since the internet and MP3 players became so pervasive, music has become much more personalized. People can seek out new music on their own or share music through social media. I mean, there are many bands I've been turned onto just through here or through Facebook or through Youtube. I think many more people realize that artists like the Black Eyed Peas are bad or Justin Bieber is bad or Taylor Swit is bad than people think they're good. Whenever I use this argument though, people always then ask me to explain their popularity. I'll take a line from Immortal Technique in saying "if you go platinum, it's got nothing to do with luck it just means that a million people are stupid as fuck."

The problem with current day music is that there aren't a lot of songs that stand out. There are no classics anymore, just "I can't believe I used to like this". I listen to oldies on a radio station and I can hear why they are so beloved and considered classics.

Belgium has a few of those artists that are reminiscent of those old artists like Natalia or the band Clouseau.

So true.

I don't think bubble gum pop stars really appeal to teens today. Even back in the 90s it felt like music had a little more substance besides just image and marketing. I don't think Kurt Cobain or Tupac would make it far on American Idol. Yeah that was heaps of cheesy vanilla pop music in the 90s too but it stood side by side with some more meaty music.

With the economy in the toilet and various wars going on overseas, record companies aren't going to push an artist who writes "depressing" music or one who sees what is going on in our society and tells it like it is. So bring on the endless dance music and dance your troubles away.

Also the only people who buy music are under 12 or over 40. So why bother to push anything else?

todays music is horrible, by and large my generations music as a whole is horrible, I listen to some stuff from the 90s, very little from the 2000's and only 1 or 2 current songs, I listen almost exclusively to music from the 60's and 70's.

music from back then just had so much more heart and soul, its hard to explain it just feels deeper and more real, also, t his may sound weird but it had horns, I sooo miss horns in music, a horn section or even lone horn adds so much to the depth and complexity of the music.

to summarize, fuck todays "music"

There are some great current bands out there. If you like horns and a more Celtic feel listen to Mumford and Sons. Amazing band. Also, lesser known bands like the White Rabbits are awesome.

I do agree most pop music is rubbish, but that's pretty much how I feel about every generation's version of pop. Always been a rock and roll guy.

I'm a rock and roll guy as well, but I do enjoy the quirkiness of the 80s. I actually enjoy some of the pop from that decade, too.

I find that this is relevant to this post.

A lot of great input here.

I don't exactly see it in that way though. Yes generational gaps between the old and young is the main reason why older bands are still popular and relevant. That, or you could argue the obvious reason, being that they are still popular and relevant today because of the quality of music back then. A large portion of my own taste in music was shaped by older siblings and my mom. However, I think that is kind of a separate idea from what I was trying to say. Older generations like what they like, and it inspires young people to like the same style of music, but what does that have to do with the older crowd going out of their way to stomp on current music?

As for pop being terrible in pretty much any decade, I have to disagree. The level of creativity and all around good quality (I know that's a broad term but I'm not good with words) of pop in the 1980's was very good. Of course I'm talking about new wave music here but that term is pretty much interchangeable with the terms synth pop or just pop in general. Also, pop isn't entirely made up of happy go lucky sounding music. It may be today and understandably so if you're looking from the standpoint of what does and doesn't sell, but in the 1980's it wasn't always that. Tears for Fears had a sound to them that was not always fast paced and happy go lucky, in fact a lot of their songs were slower in pace and downright mysterious sounding in tone. You could even say it was an odd hybrid between something that was upbeat and depressing, which is something that I can't even put into words. To me, that's an amazing thing for an artist to capture.

A lot of pop music today may be uninspired shit, but it's not all bad. Look in the right places and you can find some diamonds in the rough.

The Beatles were pop when they started. They became something else and lasted the test of time, but on Ed Sullivan, they were pop.

I'm kind of curious here as to what your definition of "going out of their way" is here.

I said before the it isn't necessarily the case today, from what I see most older folks leave current music alone because they don't care enough to try to enjoy it or whatever but it has been the case throughout the decades am I right? In any case, it's just something to think about.

An example of this might be, back in the 1980's when mom's tried to get Twisted Sister's music banned. Or just any regular asshole who would go out of their way to say how bad it is. I understand that everyone is entitled to their opinion, that's fine, but there's a point when that turns into pointless cruelty and it's no longer constructive criticism. It can actually take a number of different forms. It's not a major issue but it is something to think about.

Exhibit A




Exhibit B





its not even close, the song from 40 years ago is IMO light years beyond the junk from today.

I would like to clarify, I do like some 80s pop. Reminds of of being a kid, much simpler times... not all 80s pop though, but I do have a soft spot for some.

Mostly though, pop music can eat me. Even the Beatles "pop" phase I think produced some of their worst music. The older they got the better the music was (until the broke up).

The thing is...I think people look down on current music (at least right now) because even if you try to avoid it, it's shoved down your throat by the internet, TV shows, commercials, movies, the radio, etc. So if older people are going out of their way to voice their opinions about the music it's mostly because media goes out of it's way to make them hear it in one way or another.

Exactly. It really comes down to two major developments over the last decade:

1. Delivery channels - Record companies now have (in addition to albums, radio, TV, and concerts) youtube, facebook, twitter and all other forms of digital delivery, not to mention itunes and other means to purchase music. Also, there has always been word of mouth, but there are way more mouths now because of the internet. Without it I would not have heard of Justin Beiber until very recently...and that's assuming he would have the same level of popularity despite a lack of internet exposure.

2. Advanced targeted marketing - there are far more ways to collect and dissect a consumer's tastes nowadays. This coupled with the delivery channels creates a flood into pop culture.

Today's pop stars are manufactured to be fed to consumers through the above. Sure, this has been true for decades, but the level of consumer exposure is largely unprecedented.

How did the Beatles get so big? Baby boomers. Their music appealed the the largest generation (read: largest segment of consumers) the marketplace had ever experienced. Right place...right time...right number of willing listeners.

This generation had children of their own, sometimes called echo boomers, creating a new massive consumer base. Why were the Ninja Turtles so big? There were a crap ton of kids to buy them (or parents to buy for them). These trends have bubbles as tastes of the consumers change. Remember when wrestling was huge in the late 90s? Echo boomers.

I'm not sure how large the millennial generation is compared to echo boomers, obviously the information is readily available, but whatever the size, it is sustainable enough for the heavily marketable likes of Justin Beiber. The rest of us just have to wade through the tide or look for other waters.

Better yet, get a jetski and enjoy life outside of concern for what other people like.

SIDE NOTE: I was going to share thoughts on how the internet gives voice to bands who would otherwise not be heard outside of a record company's promotion, but I've meandered far enough off track.