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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Sun Sep 25, 2011 12:19 pm 
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Link wrote:
Darkseid wrote:
Plus she's one of the few women who can get under Bruce Wayne's skin.


Her greatest weapon over him is her sexuality. The moment she gives him that is the moment she loses any and all advantage she ever had. I mean, she's been able to make him turn a blind eye to her crimes in her villain days with just a simple kiss. It feels a bit too impulsive for me, but it is the new 52 and we'll see where everything pans out. I'm just saying I could've definitely done without the art, regardless of age. I try not to feel embarrassed reading a comic in public (tough I know) and pages like this make it a lot worse I suppose due to the pre-existing stigma of comics being all about sexy half naked unrealistic ladies and dudes wearing their underwear the wrong way.

You were reading Catwoman, a book with covers that show a woman in a skin tight suit.

Totally something to read in public.

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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Sun Sep 25, 2011 1:09 pm 
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Darkseid wrote:
FICTIONAL CHARACTERS WITH CHEMISTRY BETWEEN THEM HAVE JUST HAD SEX IN A WAY THAT'S IN CHARACTER FOR THEM!

MY FAITH HAS BEEN SHATTERED!!


Being seductive = Being a slut

I gotcha

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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Sun Sep 25, 2011 10:43 pm 
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Darkseid wrote:
You were reading Catwoman, a book with covers that show a woman in a skin tight suit.

Totally something to read in public.


That's a dumb argument though because 95% of the public know who Catwoman is whether from a terrible movie or from a Tim Burton movie or because of Adam West. She transcends that sort of stigma, or at least she should when compared to, perhaps, Powergirl. Not every Catwoman cover is done by Adam Hughes y'know. :)

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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 3:55 am 
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Link wrote:
Darkseid wrote:
Plus she's one of the few women who can get under Bruce Wayne's skin.


Her greatest weapon over him is her sexuality. The moment she gives him that is the moment she loses any and all advantage she ever had. I mean, she's been able to make him turn a blind eye to her crimes in her villain days with just a simple kiss. It feels a bit too impulsive for me, but it is the new 52 and we'll see where everything pans out. I'm just saying I could've definitely done without the art, regardless of age. I try not to feel embarrassed reading a comic in public (tough I know) and pages like this make it a lot worse I suppose due to the pre-existing stigma of comics being all about sexy half naked unrealistic ladies and dudes wearing their underwear the wrong way.



Ok I'm a little confused here, so perhaps some clarification may be in order.

A) Are you saying now that they've done it, she can't string Bruce along?

B) Do you think that she doesn't really want Bruce/ to be with Bruce and that having sex will hurt the chemistry of their characters?

C) Do you actually read comics out in public? (If its an iPad that's understandable)

Going as far back as The Long Halloween this has been something writers have teased for years. Eventually someone was going to come along and flat out show that yes, Batman and Catwoman have gotten it on. Its beyond the point of her trying to string him along too. Its long been established that they both genuinely care for one anther and Selina has shown no signs of even wanting to manipulate Bruce for a long time now. Also, Catwoman is impulsive. She's an anti-hero who, on on occasion breaks the law whenever she feels like. Hell, that was pretty much her entire character arc from Gotham City Sirens.

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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 8:24 am 
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In regards to A & B, possibly yes. Selina wants Bruce, and MAYBE Bruce wants Selina (depending on the writer) They both care about each other but that doesn't mean there can't be plenty of stringing/teasing without them actually doing the deed. In the end all I'm really trying to say though is that the sex scene was a lot more visceral than it needed to be. You can show a sex-scene without showing too much, and as far as I'm concerned this particular scene showed too much for my tastes (and obviously the tastes of many others.)

As for reading in public, yeah, I read single issues, TPBs, and iPad stuff in public all the time. Made quite a few unexpected friends in coffee shops because of it.

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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 11:00 am 
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This batman catwoman thing reminds me of The Nanny. The entire show was based around the two (Fran and Maxwell) meandering around each other, and it all turned sour after they hooked up. Wonder if it'll be the case here.

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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 12:24 pm 
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Puddle Jumper wrote:
This batman catwoman thing reminds me of The Nanny. The entire show was based around the two (Fran and Maxwell) meandering around each other, and it all turned sour after they hooked up. Wonder if it'll be the case here.


Doubtful, it's not the first time they've had relations as far as I am aware. Bruce was with Selina Kyle, Catwoman and Batman have kissed on several occasions, and there's a deep respect/love going on there. This might just be the first time they have in this New 52, or it might just be the most "smack you in the face obvious" example of them having such relations.

I think more people are thinking of this as the icing on the cake though, due to how much Catwoman's comic is being built strictly around "sex appeal and t&a shots" in the artwork. Even Gotham City Sirens was a bit less obvious in its "fanwank" than this comic.

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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 2:40 pm 
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Link wrote:
Puddle Jumper wrote:
This batman catwoman thing reminds me of The Nanny. The entire show was based around the two (Fran and Maxwell) meandering around each other, and it all turned sour after they hooked up. Wonder if it'll be the case here.


Doubtful, it's not the first time they've had relations as far as I am aware. Bruce was with Selina Kyle, Catwoman and Batman have kissed on several occasions, and there's a deep respect/love going on there. This might just be the first time they have in this New 52, or it might just be the most "smack you in the face obvious" example of them having such relations.

I think more people are thinking of this as the icing on the cake though, due to how much Catwoman's comic is being built strictly around "sex appeal and t&a shots" in the artwork. Even Gotham City Sirens was a bit less obvious in its "fanwank" than this comic.


Fran and Maxwell kissed as well. They also told each other they loved each other. But they never "did it" or got together for long. Part of what made it worked.

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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2011 9:52 am 
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^ This sums it up a lot better than I ever could. Ultimately it's a lot less about what happened but how it was written and depicted, and very simply that means "FOR MEN ONLY, AND WOMEN WHO DON'T MIND BEING A PIECE OF MEAT". Brubaker's Catwoman, with or without Darwyn Cooke didn't focus nearly as much in the art on the T&A. There weren't zoomed in shots of cleavage only or huge butt shots taking up the panel with the camera basically giving her a rimjob due to its proximity.

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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2011 1:22 pm 
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somewhat glad out of the reboot i've only read justice league and batgirl

(i say somewhat because justice league was too confusing to be any good and batgirl felt like a slap in the face)

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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2011 2:28 pm 
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Sollah wrote:
somewhat glad out of the reboot i've only read justice league and batgirl


I'm confused about how Justice League could be confusing if it was a starting point. O_o I didn't read it, but it sounded straight forward to me.

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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:09 am 
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because i don't know why they don't know each other, or why they started that far back, or

but the more important question is what was with that fucking flashback in catwoman #1, which I just read, right now

argh, why am I even reading any of these

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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 2:36 am 
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Sollah wrote:
because i don't know why they don't know each other, or why they started that far back, or

but the more important question is what was with that fucking flashback in catwoman #1, which I just read, right now

argh, why am I even reading any of these


The easiest explanation the book is this is the beginning. There was never any super hero teams prior to this point. Aside from Action Comics and All-Star Western this is the earliest story set in the new timeline.

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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 3:10 am 
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so do all the #1 comics take place at different times then

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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 3:56 am 
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Sollah wrote:
so do all the #1 comics take place at different times then


All-Star Western is set in the 1800s, Action Comics is pretty much the earliest starting point for their "dawn of super heroes", each individual #1 is going to focus on the singular character in a current timeframe and as it stands right now Justice League is set 5 years before all of them (with the obvious exceptions).

So Green Lantern meeting Batman is pretty much the first time any of these characters have ever interacted. This is also the reason Vic Stone isn't the Cyborg yet.

EDIT

Minor Correction: Demon Knights would be the earliest book being set during the medieval period. Totally forgot about that one.

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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 9:26 am 
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Sollah wrote:
so do all the #1 comics take place at different times then


More or less. There are a few comics that seem related in time like Detective Comics is a Year One setting because there's no Batman, Inc. and police don't like him. Batman is in the "present". Batman & Robin is also in the present due to Damien. Nightwing is also the present. Batgirl, not sure where in time that lies, I'd say before the present, she still seems to be a vigilante. Action Comics is Year One. Justice League is ultra Year One. Suicide Squad seems to be related to Detective Comics' timeline. Swamp Thing might be post-Brightest Day.

Basically what they seem to be doing is keeping linear non-shared timelines, this might change as arcs go on, but I think they're trying to avoid having everything tie in and be ultra confusing, so if you wanted to read one or two comics that's ALL you need to ever read.

As you'll most likely see today if you watch YIBR, Beeslo had a lot of these same concerns and confusions.

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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Sat Oct 01, 2011 10:38 pm 
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Link wrote:
Low Budget Jeff wrote:
I was interested in Red Hood simply because I thought Jason Todd as a character was always pretty interesting. At least until he got himself crowbar'd up.


They turn Starfire into an emotionless sex bunny, more or less is the vibe I'm getting from everything I've seen/read.


I gotta agree with you. Look, I'm no saint, but I sometimes think porn and awesome should be kept apart. Sometimes having your porn in your awesome, is better, sometimes it's worse, like dunking a chocolate chip cookie in scotch.

However, someone made this: http://www.menagea3.net/images/Starfire.jpg

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Imagine if someone took this Starfire and mixed her with the Teen Titans Starfire.


Also, fair warning, the site it's on is a webcomic that's like an archie comic by way of a sex comedy, so NSFW if you want to see what else the author has written.

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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Sat Oct 01, 2011 11:37 pm 
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I honestly like what they're doing with Roy and I think something interesting could be done with Red Hood...but they did screw up Starfire sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo bad. It makes sense with Catwoman, sex appeal is a massive part of her personality and a big reason for many of her actions. The panel in question is a bit far but easy to see happening. With Starfire, it makes zero sense since her character is a kind soul who's hardened from the time she was enslaved and tormented, she's not some easy slut who remembers none of her friends. That's the real bullshit.

Also, is Justice League Dark out yet? I wanna see John Constitine hanging out with the DC magic guys.

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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2011 4:03 am 
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Darkseid wrote:
I honestly like what they're doing with Roy and I think something interesting could be done with Red Hood...but they did screw up Starfire sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo bad. It makes sense with Catwoman, sex appeal is a massive part of her personality and a big reason for many of her actions. The panel in question is a bit far but easy to see happening. With Starfire, it makes zero sense since her character is a kind soul who's hardened from the time she was enslaved and tormented, she's not some easy slut who remembers none of her friends. That's the real bullshit.


Pretty much how I felt about it. I thought the book started out pretty strong; and I like the direction they went with Jason and Roy. But once it cut to the beach is where the book started to lose me. The handling of Starfire was pretty bad. My other gripe was that nothing happens past that opening outside from the final panel. I'm going to give the book a bit to see what happens in the first arc, but Lobdell needs to pick up the slack. Teen Titans was a better team book, so the guy still has the ability to tell a good story which is partly why I'm giving it a shot still.

Did anyone else read the bit of news about Dan Didio saying that there hasn't been a single Crisis in the DCnU? While I'm fine with wiping out a few of them that wouldn't have worked with the new timeline; what does this say about Hal Jordan? I know Blackest Night has never been looked at as a Crisis, but I get the feeling it never happened either, considering it would mean that a ton of characters would have to die and return between the timeframe of Justice League #1 and Green Lantern #1. Furthermore that means Zero Hour never happened. Hell if Infinite Crisis never happened, I'm guessing its safe to say that Death in the Family never happened as well. Or maybe it did. I don't know, but it makes things a bit more confusing. This must be what the aftermath of Crisis on Infinite Earths must have been like wondering how much of the history has carried over.

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 Post subject: Re: Current thoughts about current comics...
PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2011 8:05 pm 
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The timeline is a fucking mess, I wouldn't even TRY to figure out what's legit and what isn't. All I've decided is pretty much "All Green Lantern Geoff Johns stuff happened in some form or shape." I mean, Brightest Day definitely happened as far as I can tell. Also, all Batman Morrison stuff counts too. Everything else is fair game.

As for Catwoman, I think it's less about story and them having sex and more about artist's phoning it in on butt and boob shots for most of the book. It's more like fanservice then plot service. That's where I feel all icky about the book. The story is trying to tell us one thing and the art and camera angles is telling us another.

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