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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 4:40 pm 
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Looks like this is one of the few times where Anon isn't trying to get attention. Most of the threads I see on 4chan with this topic say that Anon isn't exactly happy with everything that's been going on. This new super radical Anon is stiring up shit as their own Anon now, last Anon they broke off from are staying as far away as possible.

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 5:02 pm 
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To WXYZ:

Thanks for dedicating an entire wall of text to me!

You pretty much call me a douche bag for having a difference of opinion and what was it, (forcing my opinion onto others and using petty insults).

WHOOPS!

You then turn around and do the exact same thing you are accusing me of doing but on a MUCH bigger scale and a thousand times worse. Really, you just saw my post and thought to yourself "OH SHIT I GOTTA TELL THAT MOTHER FUCKER WHAT'S WHAT!". Wouldn't that make you..... A troll?

If not that then saying that I have a mutilated penis, divorced parents and a drug problem sure as hell makes you one. By the way, that is comedy gold right there.

The little feud that was happening between me and Nosebleed was over and then you came in and threw a shit storm. Well, I'm literally lost for words at this point but be proud of the fact that you made me laugh with your bullshit wall of text.

:-D

WELCOME TO THE FORUM BUDDY!

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 5:04 pm 
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mscupcakes wrote:
Now there's one point of your post I'm slightest confused about.

You compare hacking to a natural disaster such as a tsunami. Are you suggesting that hacking is inevitable on any platform, or that the scope of the damaged caused by it is proportional to a natural disaster?

Also try to keep the ad hominem attacks (regardless of how funny they might be) to a minimum in the future if you can.


For the insults, yes, I should. You know what,
Max, I'd like to give you a formal apology.

I was wrong, very wrong, with my actions.

It was incredibly improper for me to have said what I had said.

I'm not going to try to take back what I said, because it's already out there.

I would simply like to apologize.

As for the natural disaster thing, I mean it in the sense that both ND's and hackers can come out of nowhere, f**k sh*t up, and leave you with no one to blame, and a mess to clean up. This is something of a poor analogy, as the main differences are that:

1) Hackers can be blamed
2) They AREN'T
3) An earthquake won't steal your identity.

I used the simile to express the spontaneity of hacking, and how there is nothing that can truly be done to completely inhibit it from happening.

That answer your question? :D

Also, as I typed this, Max responded, and I typed a long and elaborate response, but PJ beat me to it, so I'll just put all the now-irrelevant stuff in spoiler tags.

Spoiler
Max wrote:
Okay, so tell me if i'm seeing this right.

WXYZ wrote:
BLA BLA BLA BLA YOU MAKE ME SICK BLA BLA BLA BLA SONY IS NOT AT FAULT BLA BLA BLA BLA YOU CONSUME EVRYONE AROUND YOU WITH HATE AND YOU HAVE A DRUG PROBLEM LOL!!!!!!!

Way to introduce yourself to the forums. My name is Max. Well, you allready know that part. XD

Where do I begin?...

Sony is a mega giant of the video game industry, a multi billion dollar corporation. You would think they would be able to afford state of the art internet security, firewalls, whatever.

They have customers all over the world so they have the massive task and responsibility of keeping their customers private information safe. No matter which way you try to spin it, it's their job to keep their customers information safe and it's their job to prevent hackers from getting into their networks. Well, both of these happened and you can bet your ass it's Sony's fault, 100%, end of fucking story.

I'm sure you heard of the saying "the customer is always right". Well it doesn't totally have to do with this situation, the idea behind it is similar. The fact that Sony is a business means they are automatically held accountable for their shortcomings, especially when there is enough reasons to hold them accountable (not telling the public early enough that they should change their password information, not having good enough security, keeping the PSN down for weeks).

I know you want to blame the hackers, but don't try to weasel around the fact that Sony and the hackers are two completely different entities. The hackers are not a business and they don't have the resources that Sony has.

Nice try. I know I'm guilty of name calling too, but maybe I can try to be better than that and you should to. Don't make foolish assumptions about my personal life when all you have to go on is a short couple of paragraphs of text on a forum. I mean, I could make ridiculous claims about your personal life like "LOL YOU MUST BE A VIRGIN AND HAVE A TINY PENIS". If you want to be taken seriously, then refrain from this bullshit. Or better yet, just accept that I believe that Sony is to blame and accept that you can't change my mind as much as I could change yours, and let that be the end of it.

Time for a play-by-play...
Max wrote:
Sony is a mega giant of the video game industry, a multi billion dollar corporation. You would think they would be able to afford state of the art internet security, firewalls, whatever.

They have customers all over the world so they have the massive task and responsibility of keeping their customers private information safe. No matter which way you try to spin it, it's their job to keep their customers information safe and it's their job to prevent hackers from getting into their networks. Well, both of these happened and you can bet your ass it's Sony's fault, 100%, end of fucking story.

What makes you think that Sony doesn't do everything in their power to keep the information of their customers confidential? And who are you to state that they don't? (Both are rhetorical questions.) A company like this needs to do so. As I said above, there is no perfect system. The only things that come even close are those used by the federal governments of countries, and even those aren't perfect. I am aware that I am repeating myself when I say that the purpose of computer security is to make it harder for hackers to get in. It's effectively a system for making them rage-quit. If a hacker (or group of hackers) is motivated enough, and has enough patience, they can hack anything. Well, unless they get caught, but the Sony hackers haven't, so it's a moot point.

Yes, it is Sony's job to be protecting it's consumers, but there is no way that 100% of the blame can be put on Sony. I think I have the perfect analogy for this:

A surrogate mother is being paid to have a baby for a couple in which the girl was infertile. The surrogate was then stabbed multiple times after she told a person who was trying smoking near her to go away. The baby dies, but she survives. The couple who had hired the surrogate sued her for the murder of their unborn child.

It's not perfect, but it's about as close to a good analogy as I can make it. Sure, if they mother was being more careful she wouldn't have been knifed. Maybe she should have stayed indoors twenty four seven, and remain unconnected from the world so that nobody could use her.

Yes, I will admit that the statement I had made earlier is not as accurate as it should be. Here, I'll fix that.

WXYZ wrote:
SONY IS NOT ENTIRELY AT BLAME


Max wrote:
I know you want to blame the hackers, but don't try to weasel around the fact that Sony and the hackers are two completely different entities. The hackers are not a business and they don't have the resources that Sony has.

I never at any point said that the two were the same entities. I never said hackers are businesses, nor buisness like. As for resources, let me ask you something. Have you aver hacked anything? Have you ever seen anything hacked? A hacker only needs two things in order to infiltrate any connection:
A computer and a connection.
The latter is significantly harder to obtain, which is the majority of the battle, but my point is this: You don't need millions of dollars of equipment to hack a company. Hacking is 99% knowledge. It's an obtained skill. To be completely honest, anyone can become a competent hacker in about a year, which severely frightens me. As I've said already, fighting hackers is an up-hill battle. You can's say that because the businesses have millions of dollars in their security departments and that hackers don't that hackers are inferior to them.
I would like to know, where do you get you're knowledge about hacking? (This is also rhetorical.) You make brazen statements about how the hackers are in no way to blame, and how they do their work. I feel that these are ignorant statements, which leads me into my next point:
Max wrote:
Or better yet, just accept that I believe that Sony is to blame and accept that you can't change my mind as much as I could change yours, and let that be the end of it.

I am not trying to change your mind. I apologize if I came off as such. I am trying to point out the flaws in the statements you have made in order to show in invalidation of your arguments. I'm not saying that you should stop, nor that I want you to for that matter. I would honestly enjoy it if you brought up a legitimate point and founded it with real support. I believe that you are just spewing ignorance. By proving me wrong, it would make both of our days, as well as the days of many other people who frequent this forum. I know I am starting to sound self-righteous, but the whole reason I posted what I did was because I saw something that I see and deal with everyday, something I can't stand for.

That is my statements, and my reasoning. I will never surrender until my goals have been reached. In fact, it's a single goal:

End the flow of naiveté from you.

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 5:21 pm 
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WXYZ

5 posts in and already member of the fucking year.

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 5:39 pm 
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I don't really know what to say to that, besides tank you ^__^

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 5:39 pm 
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You may think I can be naive with some of the points I try to make, and I will agree that yes I can be naive (aren't we all at certain times), but at least I believe in what I say and I can back it up with my own arguments rather than saying "I'm right, you're wrong, eat my shit loser".

I pride myself on the fact that I am in no way a hypocrite. You on the other hand, are a colossal hypocrite. I would also never look at someones post and decide that I hate it and hate them because they have a difference of opinion and then go into writing a giant ass wall of text disproving everything they say and saying stupid shit like "you are a drug addict, your parents are divorced, you have a tiny dick, whatever".

And yes I know you don't hate me as you have stated before, but what is my first thought suppose to be when I see a reply like that?

You may think my arguments are weak, and that's okay. I'm still not an asshole, or a troll.

It seems we both have a far way to go.

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 5:43 pm 
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You know, that's very true.
And you brought up an excellent point,
being that we never really got off on the right foot.

Hello there Max, I'm WXYZ.
Nice to meet you! ^__^

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 5:48 pm 
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Hey, sunshine, here's the deal. People are going over your posts with a fine tooth-comb because they are trying to smash the notion in to your brain that you are, in fact, mistaken. Some of it might be pure opinion, but even if they throw facts at you as if they were a monkey flinging poo, you put up a giant assed window and laugh at the funny monkey, disregarding the poo altogether. But, no. You prefer to be the idiot know-it-all customer claiming that the appliance is made in Korea when it has "MADE IN JAPAN" plastered all over it in big, green, neon lights.

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 5:49 pm 
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Puddle Jumper wrote:
Hey, sunshine, here's the deal. People are going over your posts with a fine tooth-comb because they are trying to smash the notion in to your brain that you are, in fact, mistaken. Some of it might be pure opinion, but even if they throw facts at you as if they were a monkey flinging poo, you put up a giant assed window and laugh at the funny monkey, disregarding the poo altogether. But, no. You prefer to be the idiot know-it-all customer claiming that the appliance is made in Korea when it has "MADE IN JAPAN" plastered all over it in big, green, neon lights.

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 6:16 pm 
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Puddle Jumper wrote:
Hey, sunshine, here's the deal. People are going over your posts with a fine tooth-comb because they are trying to smash the notion in to your brain that you are, in fact, mistaken. Some of it might be pure opinion, but even if they throw facts at you as if they were a monkey flinging poo, you put up a giant assed window and laugh at the funny monkey, disregarding the poo altogether. But, no. You prefer to be the idiot know-it-all customer claiming that the appliance is made in Korea when it has "MADE IN JAPAN" plastered all over it in big, green, neon lights.

Are you saying that I shouldn't respond to someone when they single out my post telling me why they think I'm wrong? That I shouldn't reiterate my opinion and come up with new ways to try and get people to understand where I'm coming from?

That analogy with the idiot know-it-all customer and the appliance is a horrible analogy and doesn't quite explain what's going on here. Find a better one.

:-D

Please, I don't want any hard feelings. WXYZ, we did get off on the wrong foot. Welcome to The Game Heroes, please make yourself at home. The booze is to your left and all the Funny picture threads, funny video threads, hot chick threads can be seen to your right.

:teehee:

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 6:25 pm 
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I think I have a feeling of what PJ was saying.

What everyone says will generally be taken in a good way or in a bad way, based on the audience (or in a forum on a person-to-person basis). This is a part of life. However, when the majority of the audience of a statement (or statements) takes what a person says negatively, ever time, they will deem that they don't want something to be said.

Now, I'm going to do my best not to sound like a hypocrite when I say this, but I have a feeling I will fail. Anyways, I'm not opposed to free expression. Nor free belief. Every man has their own beliefs, and that is the most sacred thing a man has.

However, some people's beliefs are vulgar, offensive, or ignorant to a point where the majority of the people hearing them cannot tolerate them.

Extreme examples of this are antisemitism and racism. Now, using these terms, I need to state that I am NOT saying that you are at the same level as these evils, nor am I saying that you are a racists or antisemitic. I am saying that minority opinion will be snuffed out by a populous who cannot tolerate it.

In truth, this goes against the concepts of free speech and expression, but sometimes certain things really shouldn't fall under them.

This is what I got out of PJ's statement. And I agree.

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 6:39 pm 
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Max wrote:
Are you saying that I shouldn't respond to someone when they single out my post telling me why they think I'm wrong? That I shouldn't reiterate my opinion and come up with new ways to try and get people to understand where I'm coming from?

That analogy with the idiot know-it-all customer and the appliance is a horrible analogy and doesn't quite explain what's going on here. Find a better one.


By all means, Maxie, respond to people when they write gigantic walls of texts against you. That is your right. But, by god, man, please try to realize that just because you are being singled out doesn't mean you're being singled out for no reason.
Case in point, there has been so many articles about this PSN disaster that everyone has a fairly large image of what exactly happened. And with all of that has been said in those articles in mind, we can safely say that Sony just got unlucky for being the company that this happened to. And yet here you are saying that Sony, and only Sony, is at fault here. When it's not just Sony's fault, but the system, the customer but mostly, the hacker's fault.

Oh and that Analogy was perfectly solid. You are the one saying that it is Sony's fault when in fact all evidence point to the fact that it is most certainly not.

And why in the name of all that is righteous am I reading this in Doctor Cox's voice when I re-read what I just typed?

No hard feelings tho, right? :)

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 6:56 pm 
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There's one thing you're forgetting here WXYZ, and that is there is such a thing as being right and wrong.
Sure people can have opinions on anything which may conflict with the general way of thinking, but whether that opinion or belief is valid is another matter entirely.

Max wrote:
Are you saying that I shouldn't respond to someone when they single out my post telling me why they think I'm wrong? That I shouldn't reiterate my opinion and come up with new ways to try and get people to understand where I'm coming from?

That's not the only thing you should do when someone points out what they think to be a flaw in your argument or way of thinking. You should take into account what they said, maybe do a little research on the topic. You've stated what you think many times, and many times people have pointed out certain aspects you may be mistaken about, or have provided evidence which points to the contrary of your stance. But instead of actually addressing a lot of the good points made against you, you've done little more than stick your fingers in your ears and then state that they must not have understood correctly and go on to rephrase what you've already said.

There's no need to get defensive over something because someone tries to correct you or calls you out on a point you've made. It's not because they're picking on you, it's because you've stated something in a public forum and anything in a public forum is open to criticism from anyone. There was no malice regarding what you said until you became confrontational about it. (at least not from what I remember)
And you say you take pride in not being a hypocrite, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't be open to changing your opinion or stance on something.

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 7:02 pm 
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Did the Tea-Party appropriate part of Anon too or something?

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 7:04 pm 
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Puddle Jumper wrote:
And why in the name of all that is righteous am I reading this in Doctor Cox's voice when I re-read what I just typed?

Man, I do that all the time!

XD

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 7:06 pm 
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Crono wrote:
Did the Tea-Party appropriate part of Anon too or something?

I done lol'ed.

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 9:15 pm 
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Is it possible that Sony could have told people that their credit card information was at risk a lot sooner so that people could have had a chance at preventing it?

I know, Sony didn't want to start a shit storm with the public but it's all a matter of choosing a lesser evil. Even if the public was in a panic, at least there would have been a chance at protecting people's credit card information.

I know it's unfortunate for Sony that they got hacked, but I do believe that's what you should expect when you become a mega giant corporation like Sony. You have to take responsibility and take extreme measures against stuff like this all the times. Even more so if you are faced with the task of holding people's credit card information.

I can agree that Sony had their hands full when their websites were hacked and that's presumably when the PSN was hacked. I know they did everything in their power but the reality is that businesses have to deal with bullshit like this all the time, and it sucks but that's just the way it is.

Again, I bring up the saying "the customer is always right" and even though it doesn't directly have to do with this, the mind set behind it has to do with this.

Anyways, please don't beat me up over this, I have read everyone's posts and it honestly seems like both parties could easily share the blame for this. It's just one giant clusterfuck, and I hope Sony can get it's PSN back together because my first couple of paychecks are going towards a PS3. I have to play Infamous 2 when it comes out!

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 11:43 pm 
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Max wrote:
Again, I bring up the saying "the customer is always right" and even though it doesn't directly have to do with this, the mind set behind it has to do with this.


T.S. Quint: Haven't you ever heard the phrase "The customer is always right?"
Shannon Hamilton: Let me tell you something. Let me give you a little secret, okay.
The customer is always an asshole!

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Mon May 09, 2011 2:50 am 
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Low Budget Jeff wrote:
Max wrote:
Again, I bring up the saying "the customer is always right" and even though it doesn't directly have to do with this, the mind set behind it has to do with this.


T.S. Quint: Haven't you ever heard the phrase "The customer is always right?"
Shannon Hamilton: Let me tell you something. Let me give you a little secret, okay.
The customer is always an asshole!



I like this Shannon

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 Post subject: Re: Smoke you - Sony!
PostPosted: Mon May 09, 2011 5:22 am 
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WXYZ Wrote: I'm looking through the thread as I'm writing this post, and I see some truly superb posts made by KnasterMaster, Kakeh and Crono, in which they express a topic, their opinion, and supporting reasons all in one post.

Yeej, and i thought nobody saw or agreed with my posts.
WXYZ FTW.


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