It's no surprise most of us here would know what Wikileaks is now and the incredible series of events that has unfolded since the diplomatic cables we're released, theres been ones about US Diplomats and there thoughts on world leaders (such as Russia, France and Italy's leaders) and there was the ones about my old Prime Minister Kevin Rudd (who I personally disliked and would agree with the terms American diplomats gave him) and now theres ones about an Australian senator who has been giving details about our Government to the US Diplomats in Canberra, our nations "capital". I'm interested to hear peoples own view on Wikileaks, whether it is a good or bad thing for Democracy, Politics and Freedom of Speech and whether people think Julian Assanges should be extradited to Sweden on what I personally think is some pretty weak charges as an excuse to arrest him, (most people argue the US is pressuring nations into arresting him, I can't say this is completely true though, personally I only believe he didn't commit those said charges, regardless of US involvement)

This is bullshit. Since when does Sweden push Interpol into putting someone on their most wanted-list for a suspision of sexual assault? And then the swedish government has the fucking balls to say it has nothing to do with Wikileaks? If Sweden hands out JA to USA there will definitly be riots and if I'm the only one, I'll riot by myself. No offence to you americans, but the current Swedish government needs to learn how to be it's own damn country instead of Americas lapdogs. Americans aren't evil but they sure are out of their juristiction.

Riiiiight. So above murderers, child molesters, drug lords/trafficers, Human trafficers, and other assorted scum across the world are not as important as a dude with minor sexual assault charges who just happens to run a website that National Governments just don't like...



Wat?

The dude is a journalist who reported on information that was leaked to him. Its not like he spied on all these diplomatic meetings and reported the juicy details. Its not even like the latest leaks were huge revelations. Its that same shit when that Rolling Stones reporter reported what Gen. McChrystal said and the country went apeshit.

However the chips fall, the most important thing to realize is Julian Assange is a journalist.

The way I understand the charges against Assange is that the woman he was with asked him to wear a condom, he did. The condom broke and he failed to pull out in a timely manner. Other reports say he vocally refused to wear a condom, but she had sex with him anyway. That's it... he's in jail with no set bail for this? Plus, its not even a provable case anyway, its his word against her's. It's clear he's in jail for upsetting authorities with his reporting, which isn't a crime.

The charges brought against Assange couldn't be more politically-fuelled if they tried!

Interesting to see how many people here believe that its US pressure on Sweden to extradite him, my opinion is that of the same as a lot of you, to me its so obviously clear that these charges are politically motivated and Kaiserhawks comment was interesting too, how with all these world criminals out in the world we see so much effort and global team-ups on a man who simply embarrassed the US and some other nations as well (not to the extent as the US with the delegates comments) Personally I think these leaks are important, there showing the people what the governments really are like behind closed doors and we the people deserve to know, I do agree some information is risky to publish (the list of US security risks they themselves made) but majority of these leaks aren't really all that dangerous, and its not Assanges fault, as Danimal said, he's a journalist himself, its people inside the American government who are leaking this information and the US is trying to make an example of Assanges, and his arrest and threat of extradition is fueling public outcry, hell even an organisation calling themselves "Anonymous" (yes, most of find a joke in there) and this organisation has already cyber attacked PayPal, MasterCard and Visa websites because of Political pressure to freeze Assanges accounts. I can only see things getting worse if Britain were to actual give in to Sweden (Us pressure even?) to extradite him and some of the comments coming from American outcry are rather sad, there are people calling for his assassination... I wonder how well educated those people are in whats actual happening regarding these leaks. (And by no means was that an attack on America n general, I'm merely referring to certain comments I heard on the news)

I'm not reading that novel, I'll just assume you said something great, and Agree with it.

Good point friend.

My apologies on my Mini-Link Wall-O-Text then haha

My International Studies/Politics class has been looking at Wikileaks all week and we've been discussing pretty much every leak thats come out and what this all means, its been pretty interesting and our work for holidays is to pretty much continue to watch this all unfold

I'm torn. On the one hand, government should be transparent, decisions made and information should be readily available to the masses without question or censorship. On the other hand, is it really possible for a government or any organization to be ran with complete transparency? For that matter is any relationship completely honest and open at all times about all things? My parents told me Santa Claus and The Easter Bunny were real. Do spouses really tell each other EVERYTHING all the time? (Yes, I know everybody either IS or knows SOMEONE who does, but lets be real).

I know if someone handed out some information that was privileged to myself and my company I would be asking for their head on a stake, so would most who had any financial interest. If you had a company of your own and an employee divulged information that you didn't want the public to know what would you do? I would assume you wouldn't just sit back and say "Well, they have a right to know." You would do every sort of damage control within your means to seal the leak and prevent it from happening again.

The problem with government transparency is that every, and the rock means EVERY decision made will be positive for some, negative for others. So by hiding the information, you are damned if it is leaked. If you release it, your damned because you aren't looking out for the interests of all. So which way do you go? Do you hold it in and hope that the masses will live out their lives happily without knowing it all? Or do you release it and then have a population that becomes paranoid about every nuke and military movement out there?

Then there's the other side of me that says the truth needs to be told, no matter the consequences. I've lied and it's always harder to maintain a lie and the consequences are always more dire when the lie was discovered. Governments and any entity that stands to profit from the masses should be no different. I've always felt better equipped with the truth than not, even if the truth is something that could be hard to hear. My parents thought they protected me when they told me my dog "ran away" when in fact he died. The next time we had a pet that was going to die they told me upfront and what to expect. The grieving period was easier because I got to say good bye. Maintaining the truth is sometimes tougher, but in the end more responsible and better in the long run. ALWAYS>

Then there's the side of me that says might makes right. Whoever is in power gets to say what's right and wrong. You can say that this isn't how it should be but sadly, it's how it is. Until the mass pubic rises up against it, it will be how it is. Right now, it's wrong to release this much information. Attacking Amazon, Mastercard and Paypal, whom private citizens depend on to provide for their families doesn't do a god damn thing except add fuel to the fire that JA and his allies are nothing but mass anarchists who are out to overthrow whatever regime is pulling the strings at the present time. JA himself has said he has a doomsday file that is so incriminating that when released will throw the world in to a state of turmoil.

Until the current government is overthrown and new one is in place with a new set of standards, nothing will change.

That being said, once the new government is installed I give it approximately 2.2 seconds from moment of inception until someone complains about something it does.

So, after all that, I'm still torn though my moral compass says get the information out there and let the masses decide. If they say that it sucks what the government does but do nothing to change it, that inaction speaks for itself. Inaction is the same as assent. If the information gets out there and the masses make radical change to the status quo then we really are at time where the pendulum has started swinging the other way.

I have a sad feeling though, that this will be forgotten in a year or two, if it lasts that long.

You know what I think the doomsday file is?



It's a cookbook!

Any of the information released hasn't done any harm but embarrass the US. As Ron Paul said, if America is to blame anybody, they should blame themselves for letting information being leaked. They spend 8 million a year on intel gathering yet they leak it out. Assange never stole anything. People gave it to him and he posted it. In no way was he wrong.

Yes attacking mastercard and suck isn't gonna do much and releasing the account numbers went a bit too far, but that was to make a point. That people can do a lot more than what the government gives them credit for.

That doomsday file is supposed to be insurance. If anything were to happen to Assange or such, they said a key will go out and it will be released everywhere. Whether it is true or not, the US government needs to play their cards right and not take any chance

some other links

Letter From Canada: So what?
http://techcrunch.com/2010/12/11/america-furious-wikileaks/

Wikileaks Petition: Crazy to see so many active about its defense
http://twitter.com/GetUp/status/12795400662552577

Ron Paul Defends Wikileaks
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vuZp_HnMlw8&feature=related

But what was the point when you were directing it towards the wrong segment of the population? Give me my cookie or I'll kill your kitten? If I get bullied at school I kick the bullies ass, not go after twenty innocent bystanders two grades lower than me. Striking out against something that can hurt more than just the offenders is nothing more than causing chaos for chaos's sake. Go after the government because anything else is just asking to have public opinion turned against you.

The DDoS attacks were nothing and the sites were quickly put back up. You don't think anonymous knew that was gonna be the result? It is so obvious their aim was to draw media attention. They knew full well DDoS attacking mastercard and such would be fruitless

regardless of what they are doing, i can not help but side with Anonymous in their standing that attacking Assange and Wikileaks is retarded. If they want to be made, be mad at themselves for allowing the leaks to happen and people from their own country just giving it to him. He is only responsible for publishing the material. If Wikileaks is punished the NY Times would have to be punished as well for doing the same thing.

The only ones who CAN be tried are those who stole the information and gave it out. But overall it is the government's fault for not protecting that information well. Regardless anything released as of yet has hurt nobody